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2012-2013 Off-Season Player Movement Discussion

Discussion in 'MLS: News & Analysis' started by OleGunnar20, Nov 3, 2012.

Moderators: edwardgr, Ismitje, KCbus
  1. chapka

    chapka Member+

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    Your reward for developing a player is his homegrown rights. Those homegrown rights are more valuable if they are tradeable.

    If you develop three great young goalkeepers in your academy, shouldn't you be rewarded for all three, even if you don't need all three on your roster? Tradeable homegrown rights are your reward.
     
    SourCream&OnionUtd and blacksun repped this.


  2. DemonJuice

    DemonJuice Member

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    Did those players retain HGP status on their new teams? As in, the new teams got a cap exemption for them?
     
  3. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

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    I wonder who got more allocation money, Colorado when they traded Koz to Portland or Portland when they traded him to NY. My bet is Colorado, because I think Koz actually played worse for Portland than Colorado, and Colorado was giving up a "heart of the franchise" type player while Portland was just renting him for 4 months until his contract expired. But then I'm biased. ;)

    Josh Janniere was the first HG player to have his HG rights traded I think.
     
  4. Howard the Drake

    Howard the Drake Member+

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  5. OleGunnar20

    OleGunnar20 Member+

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    good catch, i'd forgotten Janniere. tho i am still not sure if he counted as a HG for Colorado (you'd know better than I would) or if he was just a TFC HG that they cut and then traded the regular rights to Colorado who then signed him to a league min (but non-HG) contract.
     
  6. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

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    He did, he was automatically protected in the 2011 expansion draft because of it.
     
  7. OleGunnar20

    OleGunnar20 Member+

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    excellent. now my confusion is cleared up ... i didn't remember the expansion draft bit ... that is how i knew bowen (and i think agudelo) were still HGs. but unlike the other two who were also on GA (high salaries) Janniere was a min player so his auto protection proves the HG designation moves with the player ... which i still don't think makes much sense but, well, it is MLS afterall so ...
     
  8. OleGunnar20

    OleGunnar20 Member+

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    Eric Brunner from Portland to Houston for allocation?

    a lot of Portland guys who played for a not very good Portland team seem to be in demand? does not compute.
     
  9. sportsfan-quakes

    sportsfan-quakes Member+

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    Brunner was hurt for most of 2012 with injuries, so he didn't play much and had little to do with Portland's success or failure. He was pretty good in previous years. It's always hard to judge these "allocation" trades without knowing how much allocation money changes hands, but the deal could make sense for Houston. They should have some allocation $$ from the Cameron sale, as well as CCL $$, so they can definitely afford to trade away some of it.
     
  10. spot

    spot Member+

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    Two ways of looking at it....

    1. Portland's an otherwise good team, but for bad players.
    2. Portland's has otherwise good players on a bad team.
     
  11. Shiver_Me

    Shiver_Me Member

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    Brunner was arguably the best Portland player in terms of consistency before his concussion. The team had a relatively strong defense (relative in terms of the rest of the team) before he went down, after which it became pretty error prone. I think he has a far stronger effect on a team's defense than his physical stats would suggest. He also had a weird knack for scoring. He'll fit in well in Houston.
     
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  12. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

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    So now that the Rapids have declined the options on Freeman, Wynne, Wahl, Palguta, and Zapata they have a total of 3 defenders under contract for next year;

    Drew Moor
    Anthony Wallace (who's been injured for almost all of the last 2 seasons)
    Chris Klute (on loan from Atlanta through late September)

    The team says its working on new contracts with Freeman and Wynne (and midfielder Jamie Smith) but that's a pretty slim backline right now.
     
  13. Buzz Killington

    Buzz Killington Member+

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    I thought KC was slim with Myers, Sinovic, Collin, Olum, Ellis, and Miller the only ones under contract...
     
  14. Autogolazo

    Autogolazo BigSoccer Supporter

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    They kept relying on all these guys who had been backups elsewhere (Horst, Brunner, Chabala, Palmer) to be their starters. I think now they're in demand again as backups, where they belonged all along. Hanyer Mosquera was the only one I saw who had "modern" traits of being able to play the ball out of the back on the deck, etc.

    I've always thought the "3rd CB" position is highly underrated given what a good chance that player has of seeing significant minutes because of cards, injuries, etc.
     
  15. sportsfan-quakes

    sportsfan-quakes Member+

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    So based on the list of available players listed on the MLS site for the Re-entry draft, I assume that anyone NOT on the list (and who meets the age/MLS years of service criteria for the Re-entry draft) has had their option exercised or has signed a new contract. If so, then that means that New York did exercise Cooper's option (even if they intend to trade him), and it also means that guys like Shalrie Joseph, Freddy Adu and Edson Buddle all had their contract options exercised. (I listed those 3 as guys who seem to be significantly overpaid based on their 2012 seasons, and who had been conjectured to have to accept pay reductions). Also, does that mean that Brian Ching and Pablo Mastroeni had their contract options picked up or had new offers made?

    I know that teams can still sign their own players before Friday, and players can choose themselves to remove their names from the Re-entry draft list. But I think today is the deadline for teams to provide their initial lists, and that anyone NOT listed is under contract. And for guys like the ones I listed above, their contracts become guaranteed when they are signed given their age and years of service, to it's pretty significant if they were signed. Can anyone clarify if I'm misunderstanding the rules?
     
  16. MLSFan123

    MLSFan123 Member+

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  17. sportsfan-quakes

    sportsfan-quakes Member+

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    If my assumptions are right (see post above), then all teams needed to either exercise the option on a player by today (or sign to a new deal), or identify him as available for the Re-entry draft. If so, then New York likely signed Cooper to his option on his contract, but still intend to trade him. By making the deal today with Portland, they saved the $75k that they would have had to send to Portland because they signed him today. Their only other option was to not exercise his option and then give him away for free in the Re-entry draft.
     
  18. MLSFan123

    MLSFan123 Member+

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    This is complicated :)

    We know the Revs declined the option for Benny but Ives still reported that teams have to trade for his rights to sign him.
     
  19. OleGunnar20

    OleGunnar20 Member+

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    because he can't go into the re-entry draft, he doesn't have enough MLS years of service for his age ... he's spent is whole career in Europe before coming to MLS a couple of years ago. therefore NER has his MLS rights when they lose him on a free. any other MLS team that wants him has to trade for his rights.
     
  20. PhillyMLS

    PhillyMLS Member+

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    Answering this from the scorecard thread because it is a decent question, but didn't want to clutter up the scorecard thread this early in the off-season.

    Perk is a decent keeper, but he is a bit expensive as an untested back-up (110k). I think he needs to go cut his teeth as a starter in the NASL for a couple years to get some experience and show he can be a starting caliber keeper.
     
  21. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

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    I think there's probably a few players who know they're going to re-sign or retire (like Pablo) who have already opted out of the Re-Entry Draft so they just weren't listed. I'm sure if a contract was already signed the Rapids would have made a big announcement by now.

    Either that or maybe no trade clauses?
     
  22. sportsfan-quakes

    sportsfan-quakes Member+

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    Yeah, but in the past those guys were released on the initial list of available players and then they removed their names during the week. An example is Ramiro Corrales, who is on the list but who has said he doesn't want to go to any other team and both the Quakes and Corrales have said that he's going to re-sign with the team. I guess it's too much to expect for MLS to be consistent with how they handle things like this.
     
  23. OleGunnar20

    OleGunnar20 Member+

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    well some players are just still under non optional contract years so ...
     
  24. sportsfan-quakes

    sportsfan-quakes Member+

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    I don't think there's really any such situation. Even though we call the contracts 2+2 or 2+1+1, even between the first and second year a player can be let go unless he has a specifically negotiated guaranteed contract (there are very few of those). So every year, there is an option for the team to pick up the next year of the player's contract.
     
  25. Westside Cosmo

    Westside Cosmo BigSoccer Yellow Card

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    According to the Houston Chronicle beat writer Ortiz, Ching's option date is sometime in January due to his contract being re-done last year after the Montreal fiasco so the Dynamo have until then to exercise it. Reportedly it is a very big or high option, likely a bogus figure so that they could restructure his deal lower last year without the union squawking about him giving up that large guaranteed salary in 2012.
     
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