ARGENTINA vs. ECUADOR /Buenos Aires / sábado 02.06.2012 / 19.30

Discussion in 'Ecuador - National Team' started by barcelonista1981, May 12, 2012.

  1. b9d23m89

    b9d23m89 Member

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    Your right. But it's just not about what Jaime does on his own. It's the fact that him and Benitez understand each other really well. It's hard to get someone to pair up well with Chucho. Jaime Ayovi has ended up being the BEST fit. NOT Caicedo. Caicedo is a great player, but seeing both Caicedo and Benitez pairing up brings back bad memories even though I know they're better than they were last Qualifier. We can't judge Jaime yet b/c we've never seen him play against a big team in a Qualifier. These two games will be his first. IF he plays both b/c like you said him and Benitez are screwed b/c they both got yellows. Which your totally right about, Fidel and/or Guerron should have been called up instead of Rojas IMO. We need wingers and strikers that can score just like you said. For that same reason, I would have prefered Guerron over Renato Ibarra, but all is done now and Renato will have to prove himself if he wants future call ups.

    I will have my fingers crossed hoping Jaime and Benitez don't get carded. I forget who else has a card, I think Segundo Castillo does as well. He got one against Peru. If either of them get carded we're gonna have a REALLY hard time against Colombia.


  2. mac-0n3

    mac-0n3 Member

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    i dont expect to see Sombra play , i think hes there for leadership for these two important matches . I was a big Yoya hater, but that guy simply does his job with the NT . Yes he disappears threw out matches but he pairs up extremely well with chucho and has a nack for being at the right place at the right time . Caicedo and Chucho usually get in each others way and have little flow up front .
    I hope our players who have yellow cards dont get booked against Argentina........ our bench depth is shit . (thanks RUEDA) .

    My predication's

    Argentina 1- Ecuador 1 Chucho with the Goal .
    Ecuador 2-Colombia 0 Valencia and Mendez with the goals .
  3. colombo

    colombo Member

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    What about statistics?

    From 01.01.1872 To 31.12.2012
    Ecuador
    -​
    10/06/2012 Quito
    FIFA World Cup™ Qualifier​

    Colombia
    2:0 (1:0)​
    26/03/2011 Madrid
    Friendly​

    Ecuador
    0:1 (0:0)​
    08/10/2010 Harrison
    Friendly​

    Colombia 05/09/2009 Medellin
    FIFA World Cup™ Qualifier​

    Colombia
    0:1 (0:1)​
    20/08/2008 New York/New Jersey
    Friendly​

    Ecuador
    0:0
    18/06/2008 Quito
    FIFA World Cup™ Qualifier​

    Colombia
    3:1 (2:1)​
    23/06/2007 Barranquilla
    Friendly​

    Ecuador
    1:1 (0:0)​
    24/05/2006 New York/New Jersey
    Friendly​

    Colombia 08/06/2005 Barranquilla
    FIFA World Cup™ Qualifier​

    Ecuador 02/06/2004 Quito
    FIFA World Cup™ Qualifie​
  4. LDU4ever

    LDU4ever Moderator Staff Member

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    Hard to lie..Colombia certainly has an edge statistics-wise. Right now, there is so much parity in South America. Every game is a tough one.


  5. b9d23m89

    b9d23m89 Member

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    1 out of the two games i HATE the most every single damn qualifier is the one vs. Colombia. the other one is against Uruguay. But GOD, it's almost a given that we won't win. A tie sounds realistic and a loss wouldn't be a surprise, it would just be a huge pain in the ass. I hope we make a difference this time and win. Like I said, we have the material to get 4 points in these two games if we don't f*ck up. And that includes hoping certain players dont get their second yellow in the game vs. Argentina. Caicedo could have been a perfect lone striker in the game vs. Argentina and we would be saving Benitez and Jaime from getting a yellow.
  6. Manolo

    Manolo Moderator Staff Member

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    It's pretty ironic that Colombia is the only team we can never beat in qualifiers, what with our coaches always being Colombians.
  7. Manolo

    Manolo Moderator Staff Member

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    You gotta be kidding! Of all the forwards in our NT system since 2006, Yoya has been the only one to make an immediate impact. It took Chucho 4 years to start scoring in big games. Caicedo hasn't done squat except in one game against Brazil.

    Yoya scored the most important goal in all of qualifying for WC 2014. The first one!! When we played Venezuela in Quito last time, we were far superior team but we couldn't get the goal...then they scored and it killed our morale and we lost the next 2 games by 10 goals...you know the rest of the story.

    I agree with bd9 that Yoya is not important because he's our best forward, but because Yoya and Chucho is our best combination of forwards. Yoya has the height and instincts in the box, whereas Chucho has the dribbling and speed. It's a poor man's version of Tin - Kaviedes back in the day ;)
  8. Emelectric15

    Emelectric15 Member

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    Is Caicedo even starting in Russia? I can't quite understand why he wasn't called up though... I'm not saying he should start but well those comments he made are in the past time to forgive and give him another chance - Same with Guerron, he can give us another goal threat which we need atm.
  9. b9d23m89

    b9d23m89 Member

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    Caicedo isn't on the NT b/c he has a back injury. He's missed the last 3 games for Lokomotiv b/c of it. that's why he wasn't called up.
    Emelectric15 repped this.
  10. Emelectric15

    Emelectric15 Member

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    Good lookin' out, so I guess my next question is why isn't there a replacement for him available? we have only Yoya as a potentia frontman but what happens if he's out? We have guys like Bieler, Borja and who knows what other young strikers could contribute but as of now we are screwed we have too many defender and midfielders and not enough strikers which we will need at home if we struggle to get goals.
  11. b9d23m89

    b9d23m89 Member

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    thats what i ask myself. Looks like they didn't think of the consequences when they made the list. Rojas doesn't count as a striker to me. Suarez can play as a striker but hasn't done so in Santos. Leaves us with two guys who both have yellows. One more strike and they're out.
  12. Emelectric15

    Emelectric15 Member

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    Yeah my gut says we are going to struggle to score against Colombia as usual and we won't have another striker to bring in... I think with Valencia we have a player that can change the game at any moment same with Montero - just hope for a bad day from Argentina so maybe we get a point then 3 at home... hopefully :)

    Heres my lineup...

    -----------Dominguez----------------

    Archiller----Campos----Erazo------Ayovi

    Valencia----Castillo----Noboa-----Mendez

    ---------------Montero--------------

    ----------------Benitez
  13. elviejomen

    elviejomen Member+

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    El punto debil de Colombia va a ser la defensa unlike other years... Bueno eso es lo que pronosticamos en teoria (en Papel la parte defensiva deja muchas preguntas), ahora nuestro Partido vs Peru va a ser una muestra de que tan vulnerable es nuestra defensa.
    Para no salirme tanto de este tema (que es Arg vs Ecuador) les deseo la mayor de las suertes ya que Rueda es un exelente tecnico (ya se que muchos estan en contra de el pero el man sabe bastante, el equipo que tenemos hoy en dia fue gracias a el trabajo que el realizo en las inferiores, ademas que en mi opinion fue botado injustamente de nuestra seleccion de Mayores)
    Suerte vs Arg... (vs Col es otra historia :p jeje)
    LDU4ever repped this.
  14. Emelectric15

    Emelectric15 Member

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    El punto debil de Colombia es la defensa hahaha nice try but don't beleive it!!! Colombian tradition is always in defending well and I think you have great defenders with experience so I don't get why you say that????
  15. elviejomen

    elviejomen Member+

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    Facil... Veamos a la linea defensiva actual
    Los laterales son Zuniga (Napoli) y Pablo Armero (Udinese) ambos son titulares en sus clubes pero juegan de volantes y dejaron de jugar como laterales hace mucho tiempo. Incluso nuestro lateral por derecha Zuniga esta siendo usado como volante por izquierda.

    Los Centrales son Yepez, Amaranto, Aquivaldo, C.Zapata, Bernardo Espinosa. Aunque Yepez juega en el Milan no es titular y con sus 36 años no es el central que alguna ves fue
    Amaranto es el que viene con regularidad y titular en el America es nuestra mejor carta de presentacion en defensa; pero once Again.. pasamos de un Cordoba que ha sido hasta capitan del Inter o un Yepez que era el mejor pago en Francia, a Aquivaldo ser nuestra mejor carta en defensa.... Si me explico?
    C.Zapata era el que fue llamado a reemplasar a Cordoba o Yepes, la eliminatoria pasada jugo a un alto nivel en Udinese y este semestre llego como una "gran contratacion" al Villareal que desendio pagaron casi 8 millones de Euros por el man y pal remate de la temporada esque se pudo decir que termino de titular... Pero esta lejos de la forma que mostro alguna ves en Italia

    Amaranto Perea, llego al Atletico como uno de los centrales mas rapidos de Europa pero se ha venido desinflando de unos años para aca nunca fue considerado en la seleccion años atras pero como la parte defensiva ha decaido tanto se puede decir que hasta es titular (si Zapata no recupera su forma) pero por el otro lado en Atletico perdio completamente su titularidad y no le renovaron en el Atletico

    Bernardo espinosa lo venden comk "promesa" porque es muy joven y pertenece al Sevilla que lo presto al Racing de santander, pero yo personalmente no le veo nada especial...

    Para la eliminatoria pasada teniamos a Yepez en buen nivel, a Aquivaldo que habia ganado la sudamericana con el Pachuca y lo consideraban el mejor central en Sudamerica, Cordoba tenia un nivel decente y finalmente C.Zapata titular indiscutible y exelente nivel en Udinese...

    No quiero apresurar a decir que la defensa nuestra es mala pero si hay bastantes dudas...
  16. Ecua4ever

    Ecua4ever New Member

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  17. Ecua4ever

    Ecua4ever New Member

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    I would really like to see something a little different up front. Caicedo and guerron That's power and speed up front, guerron has been scoring tones of goals down in brazil playing up front and well caicedo is just a beast we all know he could put it away.
    I find that Benitez only does good in Mexico but that's just my opinion, we have great players rueda just has to try something different specially against the bigger teams.
    Valencia on the right Montero on the left with the Caicedo and Guerron as forwards as I mentioned.
    Deadly combo
  18. Emelectric15

    Emelectric15 Member

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    I agree for the most part but against Argentina I think it's best to play defensively and rely on fast counters with Valencia, Benitez and Montero. If Guerron was called by Rueda I would put him up front with Benitez and move Valencia to CM for Castillo then put Montero on the right but this is what we have to work with atm.
  19. b9d23m89

    b9d23m89 Member

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    unfortunately guerron and felipe caicedo are not options for us since they weren't called up. Guerron would have be a perfect imapct player for the second half, not so much as a starter. This game was made for Felipe Caicedo to play as a lone striker for more reasons than one. He strong, can hold onto the ball, bring it up, and takes advantage of the opportunities he has. Montero MUST start. The kids been awesome at coming down and recovering the ball and marking opponents when his team doesnt have posession in Betis. That aspect of his game has improved significantly. If Guerron started this game, I'd be scared to play him on the wing b/c i'm not so sure if he'd help out defending like Montero does. But in the second half, he'd be awesome for 20 minutes or so. With Gaibor and Caicedo i'd eliminate Benitez and Jaime up front and add in Gaibor to the midfield to have Felipe as the lone striker.
  20. Manolo

    Manolo Moderator Staff Member

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    If you look at how Vizuete lined up 4 years ago, he had a 4-5-1 with Carlos Tenorio up front, Valencia as a right sided midfielder and Guerron on the right wing. Tactically it was brilliant, and there's no reason to play any different this time.

    However, everyone except Rueda realizes that neither Yoya nor Chucho can play as a lone striker at this level. Chucho is too small and Yoya is too inexperienced. Borja might have been a better option for this game, but even he wasn't called up. A 4-4-2 is suicide in my opinion, especially because our defenders are young and might make mistakes - it will be a big test for them.

    I'm hoping that another brilliant game by Valencia, Chucho, Mendez or someone else will once again save Rueda's ass... but I'd really like to see a solid, organized team that controls the tempo of the game and doesn't make mistakes.
  21. Manolo

    Manolo Moderator Staff Member

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    I like this lineup, except probably Suarez will start instead of Mendez.

    I like our defense, they are young and hungry, but with Ayovi to provide calm and leadership.

    Montero and Benitez will provide plenty of speed on the counterattack, which will require Argentina's defense to stay back.

    Our midfield will be defending most of the time, but Valencia, Castillo and Noboa are not afraid to put in some hard tackles on Messi and co.
  22. Manolo

    Manolo Moderator Staff Member

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    Deportivo Quito just got Nelson Acosta as DT. How come our clubs get more internationally experienced coaches than our NT?
  23. lav92

    lav92 Member

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    Because Chiriboga would rather see his team do good. I got the tune-in app recently and I've listened to a lot of the commentators on some of these Ecuadorian soccer stations and they defend what Rueda does in a few cases. Some of these guys were even asking for Alex Bolaños in the NT. LOL! Then they blamed Vizuete for not making the world cup which I thought was a bit of an overreaction. I wonder what we would've been like playing under Fosatti or Bauza for a couple years now.
  24. viagoal

    viagoal Member

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    ???

    -----------Banguera----------------

    Archiller----Campos----Erazo------Mendez

    Valencia----Castillo----Noboa-----Montero

    ---------------Ibara--------------

    ----------------Benitez
  25. mac-0n3

    mac-0n3 Member

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    Mendez at LB?? Ibara starting with chucho as lone striker...... no way man . I think that would be disastrous . Ibara has been impressing but i wouldnt want him starting a major game like this just yet . Valencia would be wasted at RW with this formation........ chucho is to small for those crosses .

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