Home-Grown Players

Discussion in 'MLS: Youth & Development' started by Jahinho_Guerro, Sep 17, 2010.

  1. Jahinho_Guerro

    Jahinho_Guerro Member

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    (sorry if this has already be mentioned/asked/answered)

    Regarding the Home grown players, as it stands each team is allowed to sign two academy players per season, that dont coutn towards the cap. If teams sign HG players, and have a full roster of 24 it will bring a total to 26 players. Over the past year we have seen almost every team make an academy signing, some have up to 4. Now my question is, what happens the following year if the teams signed 2 that year? Will teams have to cut two players to put last years signees into the 24, to be able to sign 2 new academy products. Or will it be that HG players will NEVER count towards the cap, and 26 will go to 28.

    If this is the case, in 5 years we could see teams having at least 10 academy products on their roster, that dont count towards the cap?

    A team for example would be FC Dallas. They have Levya who signed in 2009, Luna, Hernandez, Ulloa in 2010, all from the academy. What will happen next year, when a player like Jonathan Top comes along?


  2. Jahinho_Guerro

    Jahinho_Guerro Member

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    ......guess nobody knows the answer
  3. TrickHog

    TrickHog soccernurd.com

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    They just have to graduate the players to the senior roster (or cut them) before they can sign more.

    But odds are that part of the expanded rosters next year will be more Home-Grown player spots.
  4. SUDano

    SUDano Member+

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    According to Schellas Hyndman today at FC Dallas practice, MLS rosters will be expanding to 30 players next season.


  5. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

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    I wonder how many minutes are these guys getting before (if) they make the senior roster.

    If the resrve league doen't happen, they will need to start loaning them to NASL or USL, can they be "loaned" to a College?
  6. SUDano

    SUDano Member+

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    All things points to the Reserve League in some form return next yr. They can not be loaned to a college. You have to be a full time student meeting all NCAA eligibility standards to play for a college. If the reserve league doesn't happen for some reason it's the same old thing they do this yr. They practice, play open cup matches, some academy games, some get loaned to USL/NASL.
  7. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

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    Although (if I'm not mistaken) a player can leave an academy...........and go to college for several years. And then instead of going into the draft, the club can still claim him as a "homegrown player" years later. Isn't that what RBNY was trying to with Dilly Duka? The only problem was timing in that case, if I remember correctly.

    I realize that it's not a "loan" to a college.........but when you think about it..........it kind of is.
  8. Balerion

    Balerion Member+

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    This has already happened. Tyler Deric spent a year at UNC before signing with the Dynamo.

    The issue with Duka, I believe, was that he didn't spend enough time in the NYRB academy before college. The league didn't want to allow clubs to invite top college players to train with them and then be able to claim them as HG since that would have led to chaos.
  9. mler1019

    mler1019 New Member

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    Thought this would go best in the homegrown players thread.

    Are there any other HG players that I am missing? What clubs have recently signed some of their academy talent that is not represented in the list below? Or are these 14 players the only HG players so far?

    Juan Agudelo NY Red Bulls
    Tristan Bowen LA Galaxy
    Giorgi Chirgadze NY Red Bulls
    Tyler Deric Houston Dynamo
    Bill Hamid DC United
    Bryan Leyva FC Dallas
    Andy Najar DC United
    Francisco Navas Cobo Houston Dynamo
    Cesar Zamora Chivas USA
    Ruben Luna FC Dallas
    Moises Hernandez FC Dallas
    Victor Ulloa FC Dallas
    Conor Shanosky DC United
    Ethan White DC United
  10. monster

    monster Member

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    Jon Kempin, Sporting Kansas City
    Victor Pineda, Chicago
  11. Balerion

    Balerion Member+

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    Victor Pineda (Chicago)

    Bill Hamid (DC)
    Andy Najar (DC)
    Conor Shanosky (DC)
    Ethan White (DC)

    Jonathan Kempin (Kansas City)

    Diego Fagundez (New England)

    Doneil Henry (Toronto)
    Nicholas Lindsay (Toronto)

    Juan Agudelo (New York)
    Giorgi Chirgadze (New York)

    Davy Armstrong (Colorado)

    Moises Hernandez (Dallas)
    Victor Ulloa (Dallas)
    Bryan Leyva (Dallas)
    Ruben Luna (Dallas)

    Tyler Deric (Houston)
    Francisco Navas Cobo (Houston)

    Bryan de la Fuente (Chivas USA)
    Cesar Zamora (Chivas USA)

    Tristan Bowen (Los Angeles)

    Philippe Davies (Vancouver)

    None: Columbus, Philadelphia, Salt Lake, San Jose, Seattle, Portland
  12. StarsAndStripesFan

    StarsAndStripesFan Member

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    Is there a rule restricting where the players are allowed to live to be considered homegrown or does the player just have to play for the youth team? In most EU countries the player has to live within a certain radius from the academy, but I was wondering if what the certain rules are for MLS. Surely they are different because of the vast area of the country..

    And another question, should teams be able to set up an academy in other cities, besides their own, and consider those players "homegrown?" RSL (or Colorado?) does something like this, right?
  13. Jahinho_Guerro

    Jahinho_Guerro Member

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    UPDATE

    Victor Pineda (Chicago)

    Bill Hamid (DC)
    Andy Najar (DC)
    Conor Shanosky (DC)
    Ethan White (DC)

    Jonathan Kempin (Kansas City)

    Diego Fagundez (New England)

    Doneil Henry (Toronto)
    Nicholas Lindsay (Toronto)

    Juan Agudelo (New York)
    Giorgi Chirgadze (New York)

    Davy Armstrong (Colorado)

    Moises Hernandez (Dallas)
    Victor Ulloa (Dallas)
    Bryan Leyva (Dallas)
    Ruben Luna (Dallas)

    Tyler Deric (Houston)
    Francisco Navas Cobo (Houston)

    Bryan de la Fuente (Chivas USA)
    Cesar Zamora (Chivas USA)

    Tristan Bowen (Los Angeles)

    Philippe Davies (Vancouver)

    Zach Pfeffer (Philadelphia)

    Order of most likely, but haven't: Seattle, Salt Lake, Columbus, San Jose, Portland
  14. monster

    monster Member

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    I love this because someone who doesn't know their ass from a hole in the ground will have a fit over the news. Good for Zach and Philly.
  15. Otergod

    Otergod Member

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    im unaware of a living radius, but you have to participate 1 year with the academy or an affiliate academy within 75 miles of the club (some clubs like RSL, CLB, etc. who have a less dense population have a longer radius). So as far as i know, you could live 100 miles from the academy, so long as you play for that academy (or an affiliate within 75m) then you qualify for HG status.

    teams typically have territories to scout without competition. I think RSL has Arizona (for example). Chicago has affiliate clubs in Mississippi and New Orleans. Now since these two clubs are outside the 75mile radius of Chicago, the Fire would have to invite a player(s) from these clubs to participate in the Chicago Fire academy for 1 year before attending college to qualify for HG status. If they go to college without the 1 year, they are fair game to anyone. However, ive been told that they still have to partake a 2nd year with the club before hand whether it be PDL, Super20's etc...
  16. Dills

    Dills Moderator Staff Member

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    Like those referring to this as violating child labor laws and child abuse? Morans. :p
  17. TopDogg

    TopDogg Member

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    Has Philadelphia's academy been around for two years, or has that rule changed?
  18. ElRoss425

    ElRoss425 Member

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    I believe it is one year now.
  19. ttujosh

    ttujosh Member

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    Are you referring to the complaint that Philly doesn't really have an academy team but instead forms partnerships with local clubs, and signed this kid through that? I am not going to have a fit, but I would like some more details on how this can happen, it seems like this would benefit FC Dallas a lot to be able to do this.
  20. chapka

    chapka Member+

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    Philly has an academy team; they just don't train year-round.

    Pfeffer was with the Union team that trained last winter/spring and competed in the SUM Cup. When that team stopped training, Pfeffer came into the Union camp and trained with the first team there, including a friendly appearance against Chivas in August.

    He's been continuously training with a Union team for more than 6 months and likely at least 9. I don't know what the homegrown player rules are exactly, but even if there was a 1-year "waiting period" after a player went on the homegrown list, we'd be quibbling about whether he could be signed now or have to wait until the beginning of the season.

    Here are the only rules we know about homegrown players right now based on published materials:

    1) There is a "homegrown list" maintained by each team;

    2) A player can no longer be placed on the homegrown list once he enters a four-year college; and

    3) A player must have lived with his parents in the team's home or satellite territory for one year before being placed on the list.

    Beyond that, people are assuming that there's a limit to the number of names on the list, which makes sense. People are also assuming there's some kind of "academy registration" requirement, but it's not clear that that is the case or that it would make sense for there to be one beyond a list of who the team considers "homegrown talent."
  21. SUDano

    SUDano Member+

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    We know #2 is incorrect. Ethan White who went to Maryland just signed with DC United as a homegrown list. Some debate about Matt Kassel from MD also being signed by Red Bulls as a HG but has stayed in school.
  22. Stan Collins

    Stan Collins Member+

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    Right. The initial rule was that you could be signed right up until you 'have no college eligibility left.' I've heard talk they've changed even that, so that even seniors who came through MLS development academies can be signed up to the draft.
  23. chapka

    chapka Member+

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    No, that's not a conflict. The rule is that you can't add them to the homegrown list after they enter college. If they're already on the list when they go to college, they can stay on the list and you can sign them later.

    Think of the homegrown list as a "wish list." You can't put a college player on your wish list. But if you have a player on your wish list, you don't have to erase them if they go to college later.
  24. ttujosh

    ttujosh Member

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    I guess I still don't understand the Philly situation. What does the club neutral aspect of their program mean? Just that when ever the academy team is training, players from other clubs can join training and not be cherry picked from other clubs, and as such, Philly can add these players to their homegrown list?
  25. chapka

    chapka Member+

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    Think of it as a club team/national team situation.

    Most of the time, players train and play games with their current club. The Union brings them in once a week for training, but they take that training back to their club team for games.

    The kids might then get "called up" for a camp or a youth tournament or maybe an MLS Reserve League game (MLS/NCAA rules permitting).

    The Union gets to participate in the kids' development with weekly training (more than a typical national team coach gets to do) but like a national team, there's no "season;" just whatever friendlies or tournaments the team schedules.

    My understanding is that Pfeffer and his teammates were called in early in 2010 and trained as a team for a few months before the SUM Cup; I don't know but I would guess that they were also playing games with their youth clubs at that time.

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