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How come Benny FEILHABER is always the substitute?

Discussion in 'USA Men' started by ayuud, Jul 13, 2010.

  1. ayuud

    ayuud New Member

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    Most of the time when he gets on the field, USA magically does good,so i was wondering why bradley keeps him as a subsitute? he's better than Torres and Ricardo Clark if you ask me :rolleyes:
     


  2. Skevin

    Skevin Member+

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    He didnt play too well against Turkey and Bob felt that having Donovan and Dempsey on the wings would be better. He also thought Findley up top is a better option than Dempsey. Basically we should have start Feilhaber on the Left wing and Dempsey up top. Also Edu should have started over Clark. Torres and Holden should have started over Clark.

    Our best XI has Dempsey up top with Feilhaber on the left with Edu centrally
     
  3. ayuud

    ayuud New Member

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    Exactly! i love how we control the ball more when feilhaber gets on the field:cool:
     
  4. IndividualEleven

    IndividualEleven Member+

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    he isn't a dmid. he is best utilised on the left or paired centrally with a dmid. this means in 442 bradley would sit or donovan would play up top. or play 451.
     


  5. Mr Martin

    Mr Martin Member+

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    Feilhaber is a useful guy off the bench. He is a somewhat risky, aggressive passer willing to take chances to unlock a defense. He isn't a true control/possession guy, and he isn't particularly physical, so he doesn't always fit best as a starter for the US. But against some opponents he is fine starting, and in other situations against tired opponents he can give the US a helpful spark.

    So, I think Feilhaber has actually found a very nice, very useful, very important role with the US team. I like him coming off the bench.

    Since last summer's Gold Cup, I was actually hoping Holden would win a starting spot as the attacking outside mid with Donovan, allowing Dempsey to move to striker almost full time. Holden has good touch and is a fine crosser, plus he plays with a bit more energy than Feilhaber. But obviously, BB wasn't ready for that.
     
  6. saxman

    saxman Member

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    Holden might have got that spot if he hadn't been injured against Holland early in the spring. He would have got more minutes that game as well as more EPL games. He was really just coming back off injury when the camp opened. Look for a lot more of Holden in the future.
     
  7. JediSoccer

    JediSoccer Member

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    After watching Holland play Spain, I can sure see how Holden would've gotten injured against them.

    Back to Feilhaber. Sometimes someone can be a spark off the bench, and some players relish this role. The jitters of starting are gone, he's more relaxed and, if his head is in the game, a substitute is in the flow and has hoefully seen what will and what won't work out there.
     
  8. Szico

    Szico New Member

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    He showed his class in the time he did get to play. Had we gotten past Ghana I'm sure he would've started in some capacity.
     
  9. bshredder

    bshredder BigSoccer Supporter

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    Benny's best games are always when he comes on as a sub

    He's had exactly one good start that I can remember - home WCQ against Hondruas last June. The rest of his starts have all been subpar

    Every one of his best games have always been as a sub
     
  10. bnjamin10

    bnjamin10 Member

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    because he is generally terrible as a starter.
     
  11. Bruce S

    Bruce S Member+

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    same guy too. Mr. Kung-Fu.
     
  12. HouseHead78

    HouseHead78 Member+

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    I was going to make this point as well, but even that Honduras game, he came on at the half for Mastroeni, rather than as a starter.

    Seriously, the best Feilhaber games have been Spain, Honduras, Slovenia, Ghana, Algeria....all as subs
     
  13. fairwitness

    fairwitness New Member

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    He's useful off the bench but not as a starter. Makes a lot of sense.

    Well, if Feilhaber isn't a "true control/possession guy", we don't have one on the entire squad.

    Oh, yeah. Forgot. Bob Bradley places athleticism and physicality above all else, with guys like Feilhaber and Torres used sparingly (and Adu barely used at all over the course of 4 years). Bring him on as a sub, but only if you have to. Great technique. Great vision. Not physical enough, though.

    Let's run out and find more physical players to fit in with our physical, skills-deficient squad. That should be a treat to watch.
     
  14. fingersave

    fingersave Member

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    This is correct. Benny is probably the best playmaking central player in the pool. He is our Sneijder. He has made some jaw-dropping beautiful plays for the Nats. I particularly like the pass he made to Jozy that set up the PK in the Italy game of the Confed cup. He was excellent in that tournament both as a sub and as a starter. He also set up the second goal against Spain in that tournament by dribbling through the entire Spanish backline.

    He had a very good World Cup as well, so it looks like he's one of those guys that rises to the occasion .
     
  15. fairwitness

    fairwitness New Member

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    How many games has he even started and in which ones did he play "badly?" I remember Bradley being forced to start Feilhaber against Brazil last year (automatic grinder Mikey suspended). He played great.
     
  16. fingersave

    fingersave Member

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    Benny gets alot of guff here because he's one of the players that are "in the way" of young overhyped talent.

    I think that he's probably the most underrated player in the national team pool.
     
  17. bnjamin10

    bnjamin10 Member

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    after watching torres get pushed around against the netherlands and slovenia and Adu get manhandled by gold cup teams, yeah I'd rather watch a "grinders" like Edu/Bradley play. (even though they both play for better teams then the others you listed).

    We all know that if Adu, torres, feilhaber started every game we would be so technically sound that spain would be shaking in their boots after all our back line is probably the best in the world and don't need any mid fielders that care about defense.
     
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  18. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

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    It's going to be interesting to see what happens to Benny this summer. As of right now he's on a team in the Danish 2nd division, as Aarhus was relegated last season. They'd probably like to sell him in order to cut costs, but we'll see. The rumors of a move to Israel are re-surfacing.

    Feilhaber's biggest problem over the course of this past USMNT cycle was staying fit long enough to win/hold down a starting role. He always seemed to be injured, coming back from injury, or not match fit due to a lack of playing time. He also couldn't stay fit enough to play a major role on our 2008 Olympic team, where he eventually was just a sub.

    When you look at Benny's career..........he's made 35 appearances for the USMNT.........but only 55 league appearances in club football. That's a crazy stat. That really tells you about the problems he had at Derby and Hamburg getting playing time, as well as the injuries that have cut into his career. Just for the sake of a comparison, Michael Bradley is 3 years younger than Benny.......and has made over 150 league appearances. And we're not even counting the cup and Euro games. Another stat, of course, is that Benny has one career goal in club football. Michael has over 25........... (These aren't stats attempting to show Michael is a better player, just an indication of the difficulties Benny has had staying healthy and getting consistent playing time since he went pro in 2005)
     
  19. ChrisSSBB

    ChrisSSBB Member+

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    Sounds like you are struggling with this concept. Not sure why as there are lots of players that fit this bill for their club/country.



    US passing % at SA - 67%
    Feilhaber passing % at SA - 63%

    I guess we don't.



    :rolleyes:
     
  20. ECUNCHATER

    ECUNCHATER Member

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    This
     
  21. Mr Martin

    Mr Martin Member+

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    It does, actually. If your objective is to have a good, coherent TEAM. I don't understand why the concept of a "12th man" or super-sub goes over some folks' heads, or is viewed as an insult. Feilhaber is one of the top 20 players in the US player pool. He's really valuable to have ready off the bench to ad spark against tired opponents. This is a good thing.



    ChrisSSBB has a nice factual reply to this comment already. Let me just add:

    Mike Bradley pass completion percentage: 71%
    Maurice Edu: 73%

    I'll take these two guys as starters over Feilhaber, get better mobility, better passing, better scoring, and a much better chance to handle the physical side of the game. All the while knowing that Feilhaber is available off the bench when needed.

    Feilhaber has never shown himself to be a possession player; it's a myth among folks who dream of a classic US #10. He likes risky passes. He makes turnovers as a result. Just because he is built like Iniestia doesn't mean he plays anything like him. His risky passes are valuable when the US needs to score and opponents have lost a step from fatigue. He doesn't need to start to be valuable to the US team.



    I won't even go into the factually wrong Adu comment, considering that he played more minutes and more games for the US in 2008 and 2009 than he did for his actual club teams.

    Basically, my reply to the prior quote works here, too. Bradley and Edu are better players than Feilhaber. Period. In nearly all aspects of the game, both physical and skill.

    When Torres started games against physical Euro teams like Netherlands in February and Slovenia in June, he couldn't handle the physical part of the game. Torres admitted publicly that he has struggled with the speed of play of international soccer. Physicality matters; it's an athletic event.

    And the great thing about Bradley and Edu is that they are both athletic and skillful at the same time.
     
  22. fingersave

    fingersave Member

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  23. soccermusician

    soccermusician Member

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    I think he is way better as a sub then as a starter.... Their are players that can play that roll very well and Benny does that, & I think Edu & Jr is the thing now in the midfield!
     
  24. Mr Martin

    Mr Martin Member+

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    It's not a decieving stat if you are looking for a possession midfielder. I initially wrote that Feilhaber isn't a true possession midfielder, and you disagreed with my statement.


    I strongly disagree with your belief that Feilhaber is faster than Bradley and Edu. Feilhaber has never been fast, and he covers a lot less ground than Bradley and Edu. Mobility is one of the best aspects of Bradley and Edu's skill set.


    If you prefer Feilhaber as a starting CM to either (or both) of Bradley and Edu, then you are by default comparing them. Feilhaber has shown an ability to play a nice, cutting ball through an opposing team, and he does that better than either Edu or Bradley. But in all other respects, Feilhaber is the lesser player. That's why he subs more often than not for the US, and why his lower-level club team has used him almost exclusively as a left midfielder rather than a CM.
     
  25. fingersave

    fingersave Member

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    Feilhaber is the type that plays nearly a classic #10 role. He's a poor man's Wesley Sneijder almost to a t. Edu is a ball winner and retainer...he directs the ball to players who go forward. Bradley goes forward more, but he's not quite as crafty and doesnt have the vision and anticipation that Feilhaber has. Bradley goes up the seams, Feilhaber cuts across from the wing and directs the orchestra...see the Spain game.

    Theyre all different players with different skill sets...Feilhaber is the best offensive player followed by Bradley, Bradley is good at more things than Benny and Edu both. Edu isnt the offensive player that Benny is and Benny isnt the defensive player that Edu is.


    Im pretty certain that Feilhaber is faster than both of the forementioned players. I dont believe you because I have seen it with my own eyes, and youre unlikely to believe me. So we'll have to disagree on this one. Covering ground does not = speed.


    Feilhaber does more than "play a nice cutting ball through..." he's crafty with the ball on his foot and he can break a defense down and create chances. That's an extremely valuable set of skills that the US team needs in spades.
     

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