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Mesut Özil

Discussion in 'Germany: National Teams' started by hackespitze123, Sep 27, 2008.

  1. deleted

    deleted Member

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    and germany has always won despite under21 teams not making it very far

    i bet oezil himself cares more about the game against russia than some u21 game
     


  2. Projekt4

    Projekt4 Member

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    I think it's good to aim to improve the youth teams, but not at a cost in terms of top talent progress. If they call up people for teams who would learn more at their clubs etc., they just fake progress in youth development. Same with relying more on the physically more developed but ultimately less talented youngsters.
     
  3. deleted

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    Calling him up for some u21 playoff when hes good enough to destroy bayern at the AA and be bremens best player at the meazza and generally consistent around those games is a bit...fake

    it could come across to him as holding him back

    but as long as he wants to play for germany only (which he does afaik) and loew talked to him about calling him up in november, things will be fine. Even if we have to give up his potential impact against russia
     
  4. ForeverRed

    ForeverRed Moderator Staff Member

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    Will it really make that big of a difference whether he is called up now for Wales or next month against England?
     


  5. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

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    You guys all make it seem like we are doing him a favor and that only the German NT will miss out if Mesut decides to play for Turkey.

    Screw that, I would totally understand if the reason for capping him would be to play him because he is that great (he isn't -yet) but to cap him in a hurried fashion just because we might fear that Turkey might cap him first nstead?

    What is this? The NBA Draft? A playground where the bigger and faster kids get picked first and the slow ones last? And what does this say for Özil? It doesn't say much, but it screams of "mercenary"!!

    Let the kid develope a bit more with the U21 team, and as far as "98.5% of the population think..." I don't care if I fall into that 1% category - I DO CARE!!!

    If he is too impatient...then sorry. Go find the greener grass in Turkey. The DFB is still the institution that that determines when, why and how - not the player!

    If Özil determines after soul searching that playing for Germany will be the best thing in the world for him and that is the path he wants to take, then he has to play by the rules and not the other way around.
     
  6. Equilibrium

    Equilibrium Member+

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    I'm with Cris on this for sure. Project, your weak argument about Germany not winning for 12 years is a bit funny bud. 2 finals in those 2 years, Germany choked but they weren't terrible through out the 12 years. I can't believe you let a player choose when he will join the team, that's just ridiculous. Germany has never done this and they don't need to looking at how many titles they have won their way, whether the style of the game has constantly evolved more and more.
     
  7. Projekt4

    Projekt4 Member

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    I could laugh about this, but it is too sad. I guess you are either too young or haven't followed Germany for long enough to know what it was like when we had a real quality team consistently. Perhaps we'll have one again in a couple of years, but not if we're too smug to schmooze someone like Özil a little.

    In general, on Özil's case I won't repeat myself a third time.
     
  8. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

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    I think it is your lack of maturity in knowledge of football if you actually believe that schmoozing any player will win anyone titles!!!!

    The DFB aren't being smug. They are being proffesional. If Özil, on the other hand cannot handle it professionaly and acts like a Prima Donna - then a player with this type of behaviour is nothing more than a cancer to a team, any team - AND I DON'T WANT HIM IN MINE!!!
     
  9. Projekt4

    Projekt4 Member

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    Ok, once more:

    This is a young and possibly influenceable kid who is now being "worked on" heavily by people who pretend to know what's best for him (-> play for Turkey, "your real home nation", whatever), and exactly like Allofs demanded, he needs to be shown significant appreciation and a perspective by the DFB as well (not even a call-up, although as I said I'd have liked to see him called up for the plain reason that we are one attacking midfield sub short)

    The whole Prima Donna / impatient stuff is simply misinformed. But honestly, Germany hasn't normally avoided Prima Donnas and stupid footballers in the national team, fortunately.
     
  10. Alex_K

    Alex_K Member+

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    [​IMG]

    "Daaaamn right!"
     
  11. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

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    And do you know for sure that the DFB is not having positive talks with Özil?
     
  12. Projekt4

    Projekt4 Member

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    I mainly know that Allofs was worried. Plus Löw said he intended to talk to Özil personally AFTER the qualifiers.
     
  13. deleted

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    cris i'm sure oezil wants to play for germany no.1 with daylight second

    the fact is right now he deserves a callup on his performances and he would have been useful against russia

    a small talk from loew to clear the air would be great

    we can't be so big headed. ever. and we do NEED someone like oezil anyway
     
  14. deleted

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    yes, these last 10 years are a paler imitation of germany.

    there used to be a time when it was "inevitable" that germany would win, and half the time in style. In general it was a smooth MACHINE that played like they won before they stepped on the field.

    It's become harder to replicate with the lack of depth of skilled players (and a lack of skilled players full stop). Players like oezil are the type that we need to produce
     
  15. Dage

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    Not because to see Özil's performance but to give him the chance for focussing on the play off matches
     
  16. smithfan

    smithfan Member+

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    I think a lot of you guys are underestimating the worth of a tournament like the U21 Euro - and I don't mean it for fans, I mean for players! Players get used to the feeling of playing in a tournament, they get used to the pressure of having to win every game in order to advance to the final - and after all, the competition is huge and will make them better! When Matthias Sammer was asked where he learned his winning mentality, he said: "In our first youth tournament with the national team". And I'm sorry but Sammer's words count a lot more than anything we say...

    France's U21 consists of regular League 1 starters and we need EVERY GOOD PLAYER to beat them! That's why Löw didn't call up Marin, he wanted to strenghten the U21 and on the other hand, he needs the experienced players against Russia because those are the ones that already played for the national team under huge pressure. Marin, Özil and co will learn that - and an U21 playoff match against a top team like France will make them learn it faster.
     
  17. deleted

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    are they devising a new way to win senior titles for germany?

    cos we didnt need the u21s to win, to do it in the past
     
  18. Kirsten19

    Kirsten19 Member

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    The purpose of U21 is to make a good stepping stone for the youngsters to get to the NT in the near future. Not saying its not important, but the priority is the NT and our NT's future.

    If we're risking of losing the most talented youngster we have in years and creating such a chaos, i feel a problem there.

    Again, things can be done a lot more elegantly
     
  19. Equilibrium

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    Since when does a player automatically deserve to be called up for only 2 months of good play? You guys are just ridiculous, no one deserves to be called up for 2 good months. He probably should, but it's not an absolute must because it's a very short amount of time. Players at times need to play a whole season just to get that call-up. Castro should have had 6-7 caps then for playing brilliant the first half of last season. :rolleyes: Ozil needs to be patient, but his fanboys sure as hell are not by reading all this crap here.

    Project, don't you think you should stick to the actual argument instead of using the age bullsh1t excuse just because I disagree with you? I know the old great teams, and I also stick to Germany not kissing anyone's ass. Everyone joins the team WHEN they deserve to and when they should, no one gets special treatment just because they have dual nationalities. Germany did not need to do this in the past and still doesn't, just because they haven't won in 12 years doesn't mean sh1t since they won every 4-8 years consecutively before the 12 years. You basically pick a certain time frame so it might look like you have an argument which you still don't. You're just so excited about having another young, very talented prospect for Germany that's gotten way over your head, just like Squiddy and Kirsten. That is the problem here, and I'm glad Loew does things his way instead of what the excited fans think about a player who shines for a certain amount of time.

    He's 19 and has everything in life ahead of him. He is already playing great, I am waiting myself for the moment he can join the NT but I'm trying to be patient and fair to the system Loew has made when he chooses who joins the team and who doesn't. I definitely want him in the team as well and he could potentially be helpful vs Russia or Wales, potentially.. He's got time, if he wants to play for Germany, I think he can wait an extra month or two. :rolleyes: If he's a spoiled little crybaby, he can go to Turkey and have fun with them where he can be the big man there and still not win anything.
     
  20. Kirsten19

    Kirsten19 Member

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    0 good play is already enough. Look at what Fritz, Odonkor, Hinkel, Jansen and co. have done in these years.

    Loew is a coach who never cares about players' form.

    I even thought that he doesn't wanna pick Ozil delibrately becoz of his good form.
    And Loew intenetion to talk to Ozil AFTER the U21 matches VS France..............shows his lack of awareness and, well, arrogance. Again, nothing is guranteed. Seems like he thinks Ozil has to choose Germany becoz the Germans' side are superior.....oh come on.
     
  21. Equilibrium

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    They all used to be pretty damn good for a season, or decent at least for Fritz's case. Then they just stay in the team. I'm talking about getting into the team, not how long you stay. There is a difference.
     
  22. Kirsten19

    Kirsten19 Member

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    Too much mind games, Loew.

    MAke it simple, deserve it or not deserve it.
     
  23. ForeverRed

    ForeverRed Moderator Staff Member

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    That doesn't meant it won't help. I'm sure the successfull U-19 side and its players found their experience quite valuable in their development.
     
  24. Dage

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    And for the developement of young German talents an U21 tournament gives two douzend young talented players the chance to aver themselves and to get international tournament expiriences. For the whole work with youth talents this is much more important, then a single match for one of these in the A team and even more so if the guy will be called up in the next months if he can hold his form.

    At all, we know only a little bit what's really going on backstage. So pls, be careful to make a hasty judgement.
     
  25. Borussia

    Borussia Member

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    Özil will play the important U21 k.o. - matches against France ... and then he'll get nominated for the A national team. I'm pretty sure he's going to play for Germany despite Fatih Terim's intensive courtship during the last days.
     

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