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Discussion in 'Russia, Ukraine, Belarus, & the former Soviet Repu' started by Dimuha, Dec 22, 2011.

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  1. Drake44444

    Drake44444 Member

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    It was terrible, but you get what you deserve in that situation. Really, the lame walking to the flag and giving the ball away there. No point. Then not clearing the ball like 5 times, then not closing down. Game was not over wow.
     


  2. Real Corona

    Real Corona Moderator Staff Member

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    I was scanning the internet today and find this interesting.


    http://www.people.co.uk/sport/footb...united-s-crippling-wage-bill-102039-23018097/


    You rarely see solid numbers on player salaries in Europe like you do in the US, but this Newcastle, a mid table English club.

    71 million pounds is (right now) $113 million USD.

    From the numbers I can find

    NBA: Boston Celtics have the highest payroll at $88 million

    NHL salary cap is currently at $64.3 and several teams are at it.

    For the NFL I found numbers from 2010 where the Giants had the highest payroll at $139 million Newcastle would be 10th in the NFL with their 113$ million that year.


    They'd be 9th in MLB with the Yankees #1 at $200 million




    It says that 71 million was 80% of Newcastle's turnover or revenue. Which means they are bringing in roughly 89 million pounds when they were in the Premier League. That means that a sale like Andy Carroll for 35 million would cover half the wage bill for one year and likely still mean Newcastle lose money.


    So why on earth would any buy a football team?
     
  3. Dimuha

    Dimuha Member

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    Would it be wrong to say that only a select number of clubs actually make a considerable profit year in year out? I was under the impressions that most football clubs don't even make huge profits.
     
  4. Real Corona

    Real Corona Moderator Staff Member

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    From all the numbers I've seen very few football clubs actually make any money.

    The issue seems to me to be the promotion/relegation system and obviously lack of any kind of salary controls.

    The difference between the premier league and championship is about 30 million in TV revenue and I've seen some weird numbers where relegation can actually cost upwards of 50 million pounds plus.

    Newcastle's turnover was 90 million, now imagine they just lost 30 of that by relegation. What it means of course is that teams will fight tooth and nail to avoid relegation because of the costs involved in it. But what does that mean? That means they are going to spend every penny available to them to avoid it, and to try and field a more competitive team. But of course that sort of erases the point of avoiding relegation other than it will be that much worse if it happens. If you have 90 million and you spend 70 of it on player salaries just to keep that extra 30 million, whereas you might say survive in the Championship with a wage bill of less than half that, one wonders who is making more money? The teams with the big TV deals or the ones who are some what content with their status quo.


    Of course the few teams that are actually making money seem to all have the same system and Newcastle seem to be following it now. Or at least adjusting in that direction.

    Compare clubs like PSV Eindhoven and Feyenoord. PSV find cheap undervalued players and sign them to low wages and then sell them on for a profit. Feyenoord by contrast nearly went bankrupt because they were buying up big name veteran players with high wages.

    Newcastle had a similar system from what I can gather. Buying players, paying big wages and trying to compete big. Of course most of those players were poor signings because they were past their prime and not worth the fees they had. Now Newcastle seem to be readjusting and going the PSV route. Signing cast off players like Demba Ba on free deals or getting steals in the transfer market like Yohan Cabaye (rumored 4.3 million pounds) or Cisse (9million, 5 goals already in 6 games). Surely if they get an Andy Carroll offer in the future they will cash in immediately. Demba Ba has chronic health issues but there are still rumors that some of the big clubs might consider 15 million pound bids. Newcastle would obviously stand to make a tidy profit.

    But then what does that mean to the fans? Well it means mostly that Newcastle will be a mid table team with occasional good years when it all comes together. One might have to question how much fun that can be, consistently finishing mid table, not being relegated but also not really winning anything. Fans of Everton might know this feeling, although their financial system is much more dire than Newcastle. It's simply another year of existing. Neither good or bad, neither eating or being eaten.
     


  5. Drake44444

    Drake44444 Member

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    You got to read swiss ramble. I read it for like 30 clubs. It is in brilliant detail covering all these topics with in depth numbers for the specific clubs.

    Almost no clubs make money except those that do exceptional scouting and find gems and sell them.

    Newcastle is like the shining light of what you can do in the EPL compared to their player sales/current salaries and league position.
     
  6. Dimuha

    Dimuha Member

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    I think CSKA made a profit last season although nothing substantial. Like 5 million Euros or something.
     
  7. Drake44444

    Drake44444 Member

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    The net loss for professional football in Italy in 2010-11 was €428m, an increase of €80m from the previous year, a rise of 23 per cent.

    CSKA's profit was in my guess helped big time by Champions League money into double knockout rounds. 7 million group stage, 800k per win, 3 million each knockout round, then big time tv payout at the end around 20 million. (euros)
     
  8. Real Corona

    Real Corona Moderator Staff Member

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    Their most recent article is on Newcastle.

    Awesome haha
     
  9. Dimuha

    Dimuha Member

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    That and the club tends to spend less and sell its top players for strong profit. Much shrewder management than other Russian clubs.
     
  10. Real Corona

    Real Corona Moderator Staff Member

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    ********ing gold mine this
     
  11. Dimuha

    Dimuha Member

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    Newcastle's averaging over 50 k a game, and with EPL ticket prices that's gota mean good cash. 40 mil for Andy Carrol? Stroke of genius that.
     
  12. Drake44444

    Drake44444 Member

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    Yeah your post was straight on, you basically summed up their Newcastle post. Well done.
     
  13. Drake44444

    Drake44444 Member

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    Yeah but what were the sales that for 2010-2011? I can't think of any big ones, they kept their top players didn't they?
     
  14. Real Corona

    Real Corona Moderator Staff Member

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    Prelim viewing from the Swiss article, really just peeing myself at viewing this. Amazing stuff. And I was relying on people magazine. :eek:


    They have made this off matchday revenue the last five years ( all figures in millions)

    31
    34
    33
    29 (relegated)
    21 (championship)
    24



    This year was the first they had a full on profit and it was .... da dum 35 million pounds roughly.

    Which just so happens to be the figure Carroll was sold for (thanks Roman!).

    SO essentially the club broke even.
     
  15. Real Corona

    Real Corona Moderator Staff Member

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    Haha


    Newcastle actually made money off Michael Owen injuring himself at the World Cup. 6.7 million in insurance money.


    Only a couple clubs actually came close to Newcastle who were clearly the most profitable club in the country.

    United made 30 million, which likely went off to interest payments.

    Blackpool made 21, likely influenced by selling Charlie Adam and not increasing their wage bill after promotion.

    Arsenal at 15.
     
  16. Dimuha

    Dimuha Member

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    Bayern's club director (or something like that) made a lot of sense the other day when he brought up the money Germany's given Spain for economic assistance and how Real is out there splashing around hundreds of millions of dollars.
     
  17. Real Corona

    Real Corona Moderator Staff Member

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    The worst part is that some of that economic assistance likely will trickle down to Real itself. Ha!

    There was an article in the Guardian today about how Bayern's economic position likely puts them into contention for one of the top 5 sides in Europe going forward.

    Looking at Spain though, with their individual TV deals, Real and Barcelona will not just outpace La Liga with those earnings but likely soon jump so far out ahead of the rest of Europe that one wonders how long their European dominance might last?

    Of course the transfer records of Barcelona and Real are so bad that one wonders where Barcelona would be without their home grown players and if Real can even effectively turn their cash dominance into similar on field dominance.
     
  18. Dimuha

    Dimuha Member

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  19. Real Corona

    Real Corona Moderator Staff Member

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    Interesting to think about the European TV deals.



    Liverpool made 5 million pounds off reaching the final 16 of the Europa League.


    The English quartet averaged 35 million off just the TV deals in their champion's league adventures.

    Obviously extra gate revenues also help but think what the Champion's league group stages mean to even those tiny clubs that just get ransacked out of the group stages in 6 straight games. I think the fee for showing up to the group stages is around 8 million or so minimum plus bonus's for actually winning.

    And Tottenham can basically earn an Andy Carroll transfer every year they make the knockouts whereas Newcastle would have to develop their best academy star every year to match that.
     
  20. Real Corona

    Real Corona Moderator Staff Member

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  21. Dimuha

    Dimuha Member

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    Informed bastard...
     
  22. Chacal

    Chacal Member

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    Looks like Maradona is having all sorts of fun in the UAE.

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fna9XMvk2zU"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fna9XMvk2zU[/ame]
     
  23. Circa 1985

    Circa 1985 Member

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    Man if Zenit could get Giovinco that would be sweet.

    Saw some rumours about it and he has the same agent as Criscito.
     
  24. Drake44444

    Drake44444 Member

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    He's still co-owned by Juve. How many Juve players have Zenit tried to get and failed? The CB, Pepe, Krasic....
     
  25. Drake44444

    Drake44444 Member

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    Conspiracy theorists COMMENCE
     
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