Teams that don't just come to make up the numbers against Wigan - OTT [R]

Discussion in 'Manchester United' started by JamesA, Mar 26, 2012.

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  1. SyedZada

    SyedZada Member+

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    Doubt he needs help with it.


  2. benni...

    benni... scream @ me.

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    Was it a call or card that affected the score line? Nope, so not really the same.
  3. barroldinho

    barroldinho Member+

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    I haven't seen it, but the fact that some of you are saying it was a penalty tells me there was a case for giving it.

    In support of this theory, when RVP was sent off for kicking the ball away, it was pretty much universally condemned here IIRC.

    Those crying foul are doing so for the same reasons other fans do about United: a half-baked conspiracy theory about one team getting favourable treatment.

    The bigger issue is that it is impossible to referee a game with 100% accuracy, yet everybody not involved in the game has access to technology that better equips them to determine what happens. It speaks volumes about the difficulties referees face that even in that case, we can't always come to a consensus.
  4. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator Staff Member

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    Yeah - and when RvP kicks the ball a split second after the whistle he should see red and no one should have any complaints :p


  5. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator Staff Member

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    Is 1m paid from Sandro Rosell to Teixeira's 11 year old daughter a conspiracy theory?
  6. barroldinho

    barroldinho Member+

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    Well technically, until you prove it's not just an extravagant gift...yes.
  7. benni...

    benni... scream @ me.

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    :D nice. Where did you read that one? Not shocked.

    -----------------

    I have to say, Im glad Mexes turned us down all that time ago. He's shite, with a shite attitude, and he's lazy.
  8. JamesA

    JamesA Member+

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    I'm not sure, but I expect Wenger would know the answer to this questions. Oh wait a moment, your said 11 year old daughter...
  9. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator Staff Member

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    http://www.blottr.com/world/breaking-news/brazilian-football-ricardo-teixeira-resigns-after-23-years


  10. SirManchester

    SirManchester Member+

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    Barcelona whinging happens regardless. It's only more convenient when there is belief about the scoreline being affected.

    Anyway, Barcelona better team throughout both legs. In the end, that one penalty was meaningless but I'm confident should they get to the final and possibly win it, it will play a large role in the rewriting of history for many.

    This Milan side really not that good, just Barcelona weaker. Guardiola admitted before the match that they will concede, also conceding the fact that they are a much more vulnerable team this season and anything can happen. Chelsea should trouble them.
  11. benni...

    benni... scream @ me.

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  12. barroldinho

    barroldinho Member+

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    There was a link on that blog originally to Juca Kfouri's blog. The page no longer exists.

    I'm not saying corruption isn't happening. Merely throwing up questions.

    If Rosell has indeed brided FIFA and/or UEFA to get decisions swayed in their favour, why did the ref send off Eric Abidal against Chelsea? Why didn't he give Drogba a yellow card each time he complained vehemently, thus redressing the balance? He must have been crapping himself right up to Iniesta getting that late away goal.

    And then there was that Inter match where ref handed Barca a numeric advantage by giving that red card in the Busquets incident. People spent much of the game declaring that Barca were corrupt, favoured etc, etc, then the ref completely dropped the ball by accidentally ruling out a tie-winning goal, sending Inter to the final, leading to the Sprinkler Incident.

    See: refs ARE useless. They can't even hand Barca an advantage without screwing it up.

    Ahead of the RVP debacle, didn't Barca have one, maybe two penalty claims waived away in the first leg? This "tilting" thing is harder than it looks...
  13. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

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    True. At the end of the day: Milan 1 shot on target and Barca 2 good goals, probably 3. That's on top of Milan getting outshot 17-5 at home in the first-leg. That's just not getting the job done if you're Milan. Not even doing enough to earn the right to whine about the referee.
  14. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator Staff Member

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    Instead of throwing up all these strawmen, I'd recommend you look into the fixing templates used in leagues known to be bent - like Serie A and Turkey.

    For instance, if one team is able to influence the identity of the referee assigned to a match, then it is likely other teams are also able to do so.

    As far as I am aware it was never the case that all refs in Serie A favoured juve - in fact it was important to juve to secure the appointment of certain specific refs - including in Europe.

    So the fact that Barca are not assisted in all matches is hardly surprising
  15. benni...

    benni... scream @ me.

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    0-0 at home isnt bad. Getting out shot also isnt bad. Most teams that beat Barca, im sure they were out possessed and out shot.
  16. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator Staff Member

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    I don't have to prove anything

    Instead, as a consumer, I simply demand a high standard of product.

    I don't know how old you are, but I can recall when heavyweight boxing was a real sport. Then after years of laughable judging and laughable bouts - it became something else.

    This is the course football is charting.
  17. barroldinho

    barroldinho Member+

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    There was a hint of tongue-in-cheek to my posts: I know how the Calciopoli scandal worked.

    This however, is about UEFA trying to assist Barca.

    Two events are constantly referenced; the Busquets dive and the multiple penalty claims vs Chelsea.

    In both games, the referee also gave highly questionable decisions against Barca.

    Surely, if the ref's aim is to help them, there's no way he sends off one of their players or rules out a goal if he can at all help it.

    So without those examples, we're left with RVP as the only Champions League incident of note. One incident could as easily be a bad decision as anything else.
  18. cr7torossi

    cr7torossi Member+

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    Barcelona were denied two clear penalties in the first leg of that tie against Arsenal barrol.
  19. BobanFan

    BobanFan Member+

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    Well we're going in the right direction tbh, and considering the halcyon days of Leonardo, Ronaldinho and the 4-2-Crazy formation that isn't a bad thing in itself. Will take some more time before we are truly competitive in Europe but if we actually stay on the same path and avoid any vanity signings, which tends to be what ****s us right up, we'll get there.

    TBH when Binho misses the chance in the first leg and Mexes decides to put an entry in for craziest backpass of the season which led to the first pen, you know you ain't going to go through.
  20. barroldinho

    barroldinho Member+

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    If there's a chance I'm being facaetious, you're probably best to take it as such. That was the case here.

    Technically if you haven't proven something, then it does remain a theory. That's all I was saying.

    I agree that I don't want football fixed. I'm simply not convinced that the cited incidents point to UEFA or specific ref's favouring Barca in Europe.

    A big reason for this is that I don't recall one claim of EPL refs favouring United til the start of the 1993-94 season, after which it became rife.

    The claims of corruption came hot on the heels of the rise of the ABU. It was also a matter of little consequence that I was a United supporter raised in East Anglia until they became champs in the 92-93 season.
  21. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator Staff Member

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    Well I don't make that claim - only that games are bent.

    Indeed it has always been my claim that it was Inter who were helped to the CL Title that year.

    i think it is not about whether UEFA want to help Barca, but who are the various people who have political influence with the corrupt bodies which are UEFA / FIFA

    But in any event - what makes corruption so insidious in any sport (take cricket for example) is that you have deliberate under performance, potentially mixed with a bent umpire, and also random events.

    So talking about specific in game incidents is maybe helpful - wire taps are better :D
  22. Invincible

    Invincible Member+

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  23. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator Staff Member

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    Is this right?

    For instance back in the pre war era, I have read that games were widely understood to be bent as hell.

    I don't recall much about football in the 80s but in Rugby & Cricket up until the 90s, the home ref always titled the games - as fans we expected it.
  24. SirManchester

    SirManchester Member+

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    I always liked and hailed Allegri. I think it goes understated how much he's done to make this Milan side competitive. Still I feel there is a traditionalist cloud looming over them and to truly make the leap forward he needs to get even more creative freedom. I don't think he will get that kind of support.

    There are quite a few players who don't deserve to be playing there if they have the highest ambitions.
  25. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator Staff Member

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    OK - me too really.
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