The latest edition of, Fox News actively makes you stupid

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by superdave, May 23, 2012.

  1. superdave

    superdave Member+

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    http://publicmind.fdu.edu/2012/confirmed/

    Basically, this is the latest study confirming that people who watch Fox are less informed (or more accurately, I guess, more misinformed) than people who don't watch news.

    Consumers of NPR, The Daily Show, and the Sunday morning shows score best.


  2. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

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    Well, I wonder where George Tierney of Greenville, South Carolina gets his news.
  3. HerthaBerwyn

    HerthaBerwyn Member+

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  4. chaski

    chaski Moderator Staff Member

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    Correlation is not causation


  5. That Phat Hat

    That Phat Hat Member+

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    I was going to ask, have they controlled for the possibility that people who watch Fox News were stupid to begin with?
  6. cleansheetbsc

    cleansheetbsc Member+

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    Do you suppose these are the same people that call in to the Sean Hannity radio show?
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  7. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

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    I'd say the reverse, that stupid made for Fox News.
  8. Smurfquake

    Smurfquake Moderator Staff Member

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    In the extended PDF that superdave linked to, the people with the lowest scores were in two categories: people who identify themselves as liberal who get their news from Fox News, and people who identify themselves as conservative who get their news from MSNBC. Well, yeah, those people are so dumb they're watching the wrong channel! ;)
  9. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

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    That is unspeakably dumb. Alright no it's not, that dumb can be spoken, it's Paris Hilton dumb.
  10. Moishe

    Moishe Moderator Staff Member

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    And then we have an idiot like Chris Hayes over at MSNBC that confirms that regardless of where your politics are the media will find a way to reenforce that journalism and it's integrity are gone.
  11. Petersontj

    Petersontj Member

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    MSNBC and CURRENT are two extremely disappointing channels. One is just poor journalism, and the other is so ideologically based that you can't help but think it's the curse of modern TV (Amusing Ourselves to Death if you will)
  12. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

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    I don't watch MSNBC either. It's not quite as stupid as Fox and has a couple of good reporters (e.g., Maddow) but it's stupid enough in its one-note partisanship.
    roadkit repped this.
  13. superdave

    superdave Member+

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    ???
  14. GiuseppeSignori

    GiuseppeSignori Member

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    That may apply to some of the shows on MSNBC - Ed Shultz and Lawrence O'Donnell come to mind - but certainly not to Chris Hayes. No one who actually watched the show Sunday morning would be criticizing Chris Hayes for not showing respect and admiration for our troops. This article in The Atlantic gives an accurate portrayal of this brouhaha...

    (excuse me for the length of the excerpts)

    http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2012/05/in-defense-of-chris-hayes/257744/

    I'm really disappointed by this whole episode. It shows how hard it is to conduct a thoughtful public discussion about complex, weighty topics when partisan hacks are waiting at the ready to pounce on any soundbite that can be used to score political points.
  15. superdave

    superdave Member+

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    I know how Hayes feels. I go to about 15 Carolina Hurricanes games a year. There are a couple of military bases nearby. Every game they salute a group of airmen or soldiers. Everyone gives them a standing O.

    I feel kind of weird about it. I want to give those individuals a standing O, no problem there. But I am very uncomfortable with the militarization of our society. There's a sort of Starship Troopers-lite vibe. We need to stop thinking that it's normal for us to be in situations where we are losing American troops every week. It's not normal. This is NOT Sparta.

    The Hurricanes and their fans have, I'm sure, 100% positive intentions. But there's a flip side to this, the normalization of dying soldiers. To me, anyway.

    Not sure if that makes any sense. But it's something I've been increasingly feeling for maybe 3 years now.

    On a related note, John "I Love War" McCain's latest remarks (to paraphrase, Obama is a pussy because we aren't invading Syria) were being discussed on Morning Joe. They went round and round for a bit before someone gently pointed out that McCain is very hawkish.

    That's not quite how I would have phrased it. I would have said, McCain being in favor of entering another armed conflict is about as relevant to the merits of that conflict as Amy Winehouse wanting to do another shot is relevant to the merits of tequila. The guy is a ********ing war addict. His views on foreign policy have long since passed from farce to satire to tragedy. The next time the guy says no to dropping more democracy bombs will be the first time.
  16. puttputtfc

    puttputtfc Member+

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    Great post dave but I think three things are going on here.

    First, we are still in a post 9/11 patriotic wave. It's still politically correct to cheer the flag and no one dares say anything bad about soldiers.

    Second, war is a business. Like it or not, there are a ton of war profiteering and cheering on the foot soldiers probably makes people feel better about the war itself. It's also good PR for the Hurricanes. Strangely enough, the two politicians I remember speaking about the danger of this mentality was Senator Feingold and your best friend, Ron Paul. If those two agree on something it's probably worth a listen.

    Last, I think we learned from Vietnam how to not treat our veterans. Vietnam was a bunch of poor kids sent to fight a war they did not understand then return to a country who treated them like crap. Jobs were unavailable for vets and there was little in the way of benefits. These kids already had the deck stacked against them and it was made worse. Cheering the soldiers constantly may be overcompensation from previous generations.
  17. JohnR

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    Yeah bad timing on my part. Horrible timing. Hayes's comments -- and the way he's been treated -- are a reminder that MSNBC is not the flip side of Fox. It's often annoying and partisan, but it's a lot better than Fox.
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  18. argentine soccer fan

    argentine soccer fan Moderator Staff Member

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    In other news, River Plate fans who only watch Boca Juniors games are really, really stupid. Unless they become Boca fans.
  19. RobertK

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    Something a little screwy about that poll - They show Fox News viewers as horribly misinformed, yet those that identify themselves as "Republicans" questioned in the poll, did better on every single indivdual question than those that identified themselves as "Democrat". Now, watching Fox News doesnt make you a republican, but one would expect a strong corrolation between the two.
  20. HouseHead78

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    Conor covered this admirably in the lengthily quoted blog post above, but I just want to take issue with this comment.

    Regardless of your political opinion on anything - if you think Chris Hayes is an idiot then you lose any credibility with me. Watch his entire Saturday and Sunday show for a couple of weeks. You might disagree with his personal political opinions and that's ok. If you think he's an idiot after that then I'm not sure we'd have anything more to talk about. Chris Hayes is the one of the most intellectually honest, articulate, reasonable, and non-provocative voices in the media landscape. He researches, studies policy, seeks to understand politics on an ideological as well as practical level. He brings together bright, intellectually curious minds to debate the issues of the day and participates with aplomb. The world needs more people Chris Hayes, on all sides of the political discourse and his demonization is deplorable.
  21. HouseHead78

    HouseHead78 Member+

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    And to add - with this particular kerfuffle - I have read the 'offending statement' multiple times and don't see the disprespect that everyone wants to assign to it. You have to completely lack basic verbal comprehension skills to just generically tar that whole statement with "DISRESPECTFUL TO SOLDIERS"

    The only stupidity he's guilty of in this instance is (a) overestimating the punditry's intelligence and (b) underestimating the right wing appetite for knee-jerk umbrage-taking
    Mattbro and cleansheetbsc repped this.
  22. JohnR

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    Kowtow and bow to the ex-military on Memorial Day. Then f*ck 'em over the other 364 days of the year by cutting the gubmint programs that serve them and their families.
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  23. Moishe

    Moishe Moderator Staff Member

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    Take issue? Seriously? You couldn't just disagree?

    I didn't even know that I had any credibility with you to start. I'm flattered yet crushed to know that I've lost it:(

    The wife loves him actually so I've been exposed.



    I actually don't have a problem with most of his opinions this one was just wasn't well thought out. I found it more unnecessary and to a degree insensitive.

    I just wanted to point out that you initiated this dialog. He is an idiot because he's a hell of a lot smarter than that. I get that it's HIS opinion but the problem is that nothing positive could come of stating it so why even do it. Some arguments or opinions are losing causes from the get go and this was one of them.

    Dude chill out, I only called him an idiot. Smart people also say stupid things, he's not the first nor will he be the last. Bill Buckley was a brilliant man yet he often said some incredibly out there shit. Chris Hayes is human.

    His comment was with regards to soldiers killed in action. What was that thingy about comprehension skills? Does the context that he was talking about dead soldiers change anything for you now or are you one of those that think they deserved to die because they were stupid enough to join the military in this day and age?

    Another killer day in ATX:)
  24. HouseHead78

    HouseHead78 Member+

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    I did a poor job in my post. I did resent your calling him an idiot, but I was also referring more generally to the whole right wing outrage machine that sprung into action while I was in Las Vegas. I apologize for coming off the wrong way there. I was trying to quote your post to make a larger point about the punditry and going back and reading it - it sounds more personal. So no offense meant there.

    But I guess I just don't see how you could get "disrespectful" from his quote, period, regardless of whether the soldiers in scope are dead or alive. I didn't see it live, but the transcript reads like typical thoughtful musings on his show. I suppose you could say that you shouldn't even broach the topic of heroism on Memorial Day Weekend, but I would counter that this is the perfect time to discuss it - when it's top of mind. And while it may have been 'stupid' to not anticipate the manufactured outrage he brought forth with his statements, the real crime would be letting the right wing 'patriotism' thought police win by not saying what you think. Friedersdorf's point is that the knee jerk outrage is much more painful for soliders families than the original comments, and I agree.

    Killer day in ATX indeed - Vegas hangover, 95 degree heat, and a stand-up presentation for executives this afternoon. If I didn't just drink 75 of them this weekend, it'd be time for a cocktail :sick:
  25. GiuseppeSignori

    GiuseppeSignori Member

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    Isn't there some middle ground between bestowing the honorific of "hero" to any soldier that dies and thinking that they deserved to die? Like Hayes himself saying that any soldier that volunteers to join the army at a time when military conflict is likely has shown great courage and sacrifice.

    And if all soldiers that die are heroes, does that also apply equally to soldiers from other nations? Soldiers from the Iraqi Republican Army who died during Shock & Awe? Members of the Taliban killed by drone attacks? I think it's a totally legitimate topic of conversation to question whether attaching the word "hero" to soldiers implies approval of the particular war and its righteousness.

    But I agree with you that under today's outrage-seeking Twitter rapid response environment , it was probably a lost cause attempting to have an adult conversation about this. This is Exhibit A for why we can't have nice things.
    Crimen y Castigo and yossarian repped this.

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