Which league produces the best quality footballers per captia?

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by Real Corona, Apr 2, 2012.

  1. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

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    In Holland this is often brought up as factor why Germany is so good. They have a fully integrated country, which is a good organized country too. In the era of speedways, internet, airports etcetera; time and space is a less relevant factor. On top of that, Germans want to win. You can see this if you visit an amateur-game. Their approach is very serious.

    A nation like Italy is already a somewhat less integrated country with, for example, a clear divide between North and South.

    The Dutch have a good integrated country too but there is a reason why it is called 'The Netherlands' [plural] and its official name in Dutch sounds like 'Kingdom of the Netherlands' ("Koninkrijk der Nederlanden", in Dutch, which is written in plural form).
    So, one can make some disclaimers about your statement.


  2. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

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    Last 16 World Cup, last 8 euros (1972-1980)
    Wales 1976 --- ~2.7 million
    Uruguay 1974 --- ~2.8 million
    Haiti 1974 --- ~4.5 million
    Scotland 1974 --- ~5.2 million
    Scotland 1978 --- ~5.2 million
    Tunisia 1978 --- ~6.0 million
    Austria 1978 --- ~7.5 million
    Sweden 1974 --- ~8.1 million
    Sweden 1978 --- ~8.2 million
    Bulgaria 1974 --- ~8.6 million
    Greece 1980 --- ~9.6 million
    Belgium 1972 --- ~9.7 million
    Belgium 1976 --- ~9.8 million
    Belgium 1980 --- ~9.8 million
    Chile 1974 --- ~10.0 million
    Hungary 1972 --- ~10.4 million
    Hungary 1978 --- ~10.6 million
    Netherlands 1974 --- ~13.4 million
    Australia 1974 --- ~13.6 million
    Netherlands 1976 --- ~13.7 million
    Netherlands 1978 --- ~13.8 million
    Netherlands 1980 --- ~14.0 million
    Czechoslovakia 1976 --- ~14.8 million
    Czechoslovakia 1980 --- ~15.2 million
    Peru 1978 --- ~16.4 million
    East Germany 1974 --- ~16.9 million
    Yugoslavia 1972 --- ~19.9 million
  3. msioux75

    msioux75 Member+

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    Where do you get that info? BTW, this give us an excellent point to focus the discussion :cool:

    I want to bring some info about South American stars in mid & late 50s
    SA stars at 50s

    Paraguay late-50s: Riquelme & Centurion (GK), H.Herrera & Lezcano (CB), Achucarro (LB), Gavilan & Arce (RH), S.Villalba (LH), Berni & Aguero (RW), A.Lopez & Parodi (IR), E.Martinez (CF), Romerito I & C.Ré (IL), Quiñones & Amarilla (LW)

    Uruguay mid-50s: Maspoli (GK), R.Andrade (RB), M.Gonzalez, Santamaria & W.Martinez (CB), Miramontes (LB), Varela & Carballo (CH), Ghiggia & Abaddie (RW), Ambrois, Sacco & Hohberg (IR), Miguez & W.Gomez (CF), Schiaffino & J.Garcia (IL), Borges, Villaverde & Pelaez (LW)
  4. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

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    It was my own work. Data is from the FAO.

    Which of these stars were the best do you think?




    Also interesting is by the way the book by Szymanski and Kuper where they identify the 'most overachieving nations'. Holland and Czech republic were in the top 10 IIRC


  5. johan neeskens

    johan neeskens Member

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    Noticing talent and developing talent are not the same thing.

    Underdog spirit? Lesser expectations? Now I know you're not talking about the Dutch.
  6. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

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    In May 1998 a poll was held. 80% of the population thought Holland would become world champion, lol
  7. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

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    Well, if you read the thread title its talking about quality footballers, not world cup wins. I think Brazil falls well short of producing 12 times as many as Holland. We can blame their weak economy on that IMO.
  8. Pipiolo

    Pipiolo Member+

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    This type of comparison almost invariably favors the smaller group. How about comparing Brazil (200m) vs rest of the world (6.5b)? I'm sure they do fantastic in such a comparison.
  9. Lusitania14

    Lusitania14 Member

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    Per capita, this is the way I see it:

    1) Netherlands
    2) Uruguay
    3) Portugal
  10. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

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    Of course . Nobody is saying Brazil is below average.

    Compare, say, France with any African country. France is bigger but still does well in this per capita comparison so I don't see how the smaller group invariably wins.
  11. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

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    No, it is the philosophy that accounts for the difference. The philosophy of Holland has influenced many countries to some degree. The philosophy of Brazil not so much.

    By the way, according to the literature GDP, population and experience are the most important factors.
  12. MOD001

    MOD001 New Member

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  13. Pipiolo

    Pipiolo Member+

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    Man, you can be pedantic :mad:

    *yawn*
    Brazil's "philosophy" has pretty much been imitated by the whole African country - just that they can't reproduce it successfully.
  14. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

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    One of Brazil's main strengths is their shooting-ability.

    The shooting is often seen as a weakness of many African players.
  15. BarcaFan

    BarcaFan Member

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    It's Argentina by a mile. You don't see many Dutch players in Latin America, Africa, or Asia but you see Argentine players everywhere. Brazilian players are all over the world too but they have 5x the population of Argentina.
  16. Genevieve84

    Genevieve84 New Member

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    [​IMG]The shooting is often seen as a weakness of many African players.
  17. Pipiolo

    Pipiolo Member+

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    It's not their only attribute though - others such as the explosiveness with the ball, the dribbling style, have been emulated by nations in Africa, and others such as Ecuador and Colombia, although to me for the latter it wasn't until they developed their own style (Colombia with Valderrama, Rincon, Alvarez, Higuita and Ecuador with Aguinaga, Delgado, Kaviedes, Hurtado) that they were successful enough to reach the WC.
  18. jinmu

    jinmu New Member

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    In my opinion, the Dutch are #1, but us Belgians are definitely tied for second with Portugal (when talking about small nations). We reached our zenit in 1986 when our national squad lost against Maradona in the semi final of the WC. Older members on this board might remember players like Jean-Marie Pfaff, Enzo Scifo, Rene Vandereycken, Frank Vercauteren, Erik Gerets, Jan Ceulemans, Erwin Vandenbergh and Georges Grün. Grün scored the decisive away goal against the Netherlands in the qualifying round for Mexico '86.

    The 1990 squad had the best keeper of his generation: Michel Preud'homme. Also notable members of that team: Phillippe Albert, Marc Wilmots and Marc Degryse.

    In 1994 we had Luc Nilis who produced goals. "Fat" Ronaldo and Ruud van Nistelrooy called him the most gifted player they've played with. During this tournament, Nilis formed a duo with Josip Weber, a striker pur sang.

    Our 1998 and 2002 squads were good, but no world class players were on them. The brothers Mpenza, Johan Walem, Timmy Simons and Daniel Van Buyten were average when compared to the older generations.

    Ten years of misery have passed, and now we have a team that beats the '86 squad in terms of talent. Now, the pressure is there to finally succeed. It's like Fellaini said a while ago: "If we don't qualify for Brazil, we should hang ourselves". He's damn right: Courtois is world class, in defence we've got the best central duo with Kompany and Vermaelen. RB and LB are big issues though: putting a central defender on one of those places is asking for problems.

    On midfield: too many options: the old standard trio Defour, Witsel, Fellaini or Martens, Mertens and Chadli who went through the Dutch school? Then there are Nainggolan and Hazard. Although that last one should finally start producing. I don't know what's the problem, but whenever Hazard puts on that red jersey, it's like he lost 50% of his skills.

    We're still looking for a striker though. Lukaku made a mistake by going to Chelsea. IMO this is a lost year. Luckily for him, Georges Leekens doesn't have much options. Kevin Mirallas was top goal scorer in the Greek league, but he's not world class. Moussa Dembélé has played many games as targetman, but IMO he's not. I'd say he's more suited on midfield. But he won't play there because there are much better players available for those places.

    The future might even look brighter. Charly Musonda Jr. decided to stay at Anderlecht for the moment, even though every top side wants him. Andreas Pereira already plays at Man. Utd and Zakaria Bakkali joined Sporting Portugal this winter. In Belgium, there's Siebe Schrijvers. Only 15, but Genk already says he'll play some games when he turns 16. These four boys (-16) are among Europe's top prospects.

    Belgium, World Champion in 2018? Maybe. :D
  19. BarcaFan

    BarcaFan Member

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  20. gmonn

    gmonn Member+

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    It seems like Argentina to me also. Quantity and quality.
  21. Pipiolo

    Pipiolo Member+

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    LOL, exactly what I was thinking.
  22. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

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    Preud'homme is the best goalkeeper I've seen in my lifetime. He was incredible. For sure better than Pfaff, but Pfaff won more prizes and played for a bigger club.
  23. aleppo17

    aleppo17 New Member

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    Holland, Brazil and Serbia
  24. NotreDameFlamengo

    NotreDameFlamengo Member+

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    Uruguay is a tiny country that produces more than it's fair share of players.
  25. feyenoordsoccerfan

    feyenoordsoccerfan Member+

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    I read this one over and over again and I'm not sure if it is a joke or that you really mean what you wrote.
    But if you're serious, what's your point???:confused:

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